“Boo Normal” & “Once Upon a Time” interrupt the flow of the Deckerstar storyline. These two episodes, though both boasting solid storytelling, tend to get skipped, fast-forwarded, or otherwise maligned by fans who cannot wait to find out what happens after Chloe unequivocally learns the truth in “A Devil of My Word.”
Tracie and Emily take some time to investigate and overthink these two “bonus” episodes. The sisters spend time overthinking in what proto-Semitic language the Angel Azrael might have first coined the phrase “Smell you later” and unpacking the need for both Death of the Endless (who removes the soul from the body) and the angel of death (who escorts the soul to its final destination). They lament the adolescent behavior of a Lucifer who uses the forensics camera to take dick pics, but appreciate the hero worship that Ella displays toward Chloe.
In Once Upon a Time, both sisters swoon over Neil Gaiman as the voice of God, laugh at the idea of Amenadiel circling Los Angeles waiting for Lucifer’s prayer, and blush about the scene in which Lucifer is overheard with a witness, “pumping her for information.” In a deep overthinking of celestial biology and physics, the sisters decide that bullets must crumple against Lucifer’s skin and then fall into the waistband of his trousers.
Heads-up, Emily had the wrong mic selected when we recorded, so her voice is a bit under water. The content remains insightful and hilarious.
Originally published as a YouTube show with different theme music.
Our theme song is "Feral Angel Waltz" Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License
http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/
To learn more about Tracie and Emily and our other projects, to support us, and join the Guy Girls' family, visit us on Patreon.
“Boo Normal” & “Once Upon a Time” interrupt the flow of the Deckerstar storyline. These two episodes, though both boasting solid storytelling, tend to get skipped, fast-forwarded, or otherwise maligned by fans who cannot wait to find out what happens after Chloe unequivocally learns the truth in “A Devil of My Word.”
Tracie and Emily take some time to investigate and overthink these two “bonus” episodes. The sisters spend time overthinking in what proto-Semitic language the Angel Azrael might have first coined the phrase “Smell you later” and unpacking the need for both Death of the Endless (who removes the soul from the body) and the angel of death (who escorts the soul to its final destination). They lament the adolescent behavior of a Lucifer who uses the forensics camera to take dick pics, but appreciate the hero worship that Ella displays toward Chloe.
In Once Upon a Time, both sisters swoon over Neil Gaiman as the voice of God, laugh at the idea of Amenadiel circling Los Angeles waiting for Lucifer’s prayer, and blush about the scene in which Lucifer is overheard with a witness, “pumping her for information.” In a deep overthinking of celestial biology and physics, the sisters decide that bullets must crumple against Lucifer’s skin and then fall into the waistband of his trousers.
Heads-up, Emily had the wrong mic selected when we recorded, so her voice is a bit under water. The content remains insightful and hilarious.
Originally published as a YouTube show with different theme music.
Our theme song is "Feral Angel Waltz" Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License
http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/
To learn more about Tracie and Emily and our other projects, to support us, and join the Guy Girls' family, visit us on Patreon.
Tracy and Emily are smart, lovable sisters who really love Lucifer for the plot yeah, the plot which they overthink.
Speaker 2:Hey there, friends. Fair warning Emily was using a bad mic when we recorded this episode. Her vocal track is not great, but what she has to say, as always, is insightful and hilarious. Hey there.
Speaker 3:I am here with my sister, tracy Guy Decker, yes, hyphen.
Speaker 2:And I am here with my sister, Emily Guy Birkin.
Speaker 3:No hyphen and together we are doing lightbringers, where we illuminate the deeper meaning of the crime-solving devil TV show. And yes, we're overthinking it. It's what we do. It's what we do. Tracy just had to stop me from overthinking something completely unrelated, because we only have so much time.
Speaker 2:There's always so much time, and we're here to overthink Lucifer. Time is the construct, and yet it is the only container in which we can proceed. So alright, so that was quite the sound.
Speaker 3:I'm always overthinking it.
Speaker 2:There are two episodes. Today we get the two bonus episodes from season three, 325 and 326, boo Normal and Once Upon a Time. Well, actually, I'm looking at the episode list and only Once Upon a Time is listed as a bonus, but I'm calling Boo Normal a bonus because it didn't make sense in sequence.
Speaker 3:I think I read that because, if you recall, earlier this season I was saying that was season two I actually think that might have been four from season two and two from season four, and that would actually make sense because about 20 to 21 episodes is a typical season, right, and we have 26. And we have 26. So if there were four that we're supposed to do for season two and then there was a I thought 22 was a typical season.
Speaker 2:It was a fall season Because 13. 21, I thought I thought it was 21. I don't know. You can tell we actually work in a biz, yeah.
Speaker 3:So I just thought 24, the TV show only had to add like three extra to make it 26.
Speaker 2:Oh, that every hour Right, right yeah.
Speaker 3:But anyway, what I read, I think, this week was that they had already filmed Boo Normal and Once Upon a Time when they were canceled and they're like, all right, just Tackle them on, there's a bonus fry. When you go to McDonald's and you're like I've eaten all the fries, they're like, oh, in the back of the bottom of the bag there's a bonus fry. I wasn't expecting it.
Speaker 2:It's delicious, but it's a little bit cold, it's a little bit distinct from the other experience. Yeah, yeah, it doesn't taste.
Speaker 3:Quite like the last time it's the fresh. I will say my first watch through my binge. It had already been saved and was already on Netflix and season four already existed and I had read that these were bonus episodes, so I skipped them. I leaped on right over them.
Speaker 2:So I didn't know what happened next. Yeah, so I my experience was that I didn't know that and I was like what the hell? I just kept going. I was like, oh, I want to know what happened and I just like I watched them, but I was like what the hell is this? I was like I missed everything because I was just like get to the good stuff already. Yeah.
Speaker 3:And that's actually I'm very glad that we rewatched them, because I was able to enjoy them Not even though I had watched through and then come back. So I did that Like I see a lot of people talking about who you know they're introduced to this for once on Netflix and I didn't know that about those and are just into watching and you're like, wait, I'm sorry, what, right exactly? So you know, I didn't have that experience. I still was just like once I got to them, it was after the end of season four and I was still like I mean, you know what happened next about, you know, for season five? And I was just like this is not. I mean it's good, but it's not what I want. And so, watching this time I got to be like you know, we were solid up, yeah, super, yeah, yeah, even though I wish they could appeal in a place where they don't feel so absolutely yeah, I think Boo Normal could easily have been slotted in somewhere earlier in the season.
Speaker 3:But yeah, I don't think they knew. I mean, if they had, if they were going to do that, they would have had to do that once it was announced Right Right, because when they released it they thought it'd been, they'd been canceled.
Speaker 2:Right Right, right yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that's one of those like yeah, what are you going to do All?
Speaker 2:right. So let's, let's dig in, let's overthink them a little bit, dig in.
Speaker 3:Boo, normal, yeah, so, um, charlie Me as as real is inspired. She's brilliant. Like it's inspired Cause you would never expect the angel of death to be anything other than like badass, scary creepy like.
Speaker 2:And like a total goth girl, like death from the sand man. But yeah, she's not those things, not at all. She's just a nerdy mensch. I don't know how to describe her. Yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, she, she, she. She's exactly someone who would be friend Ella. You know, there's a reason why she loves both with friend Ella. Yeah, you know, like that you can totally see that Um, and then you can also see why she did it right, like, I don't know, she's just an angel for the job of death, because it would be someone gentle, um, and and to, like, I don't know, get interested in individuals while still having having some distance. I don't know, I just like if she looked like what we expected, you know, like grim reaper type thing that would be too scary.
Speaker 2:Well, also, I think, because of the cosmology of the show, you know that that the great before and the great after, you know the great beyond are both actually like when we, when we have that full scope in our minds, like death is actually just a transition, it's not actually an end, and so it makes sense that it's not this like that, it's more this Azrael and less maze, which is you know, sort of what's expected with a demon blade and whatever is in line to with Neil Gaiman storytelling.
Speaker 2:I just mentioned Sandman, which, now that the new series is available on Netflix, I'm part way through no spoilers, y'all, although I read the graphic novel, so I guess I guess I've already spoiled it for myself. But one of the things that's really interesting to me that I've been thinking about with Azrael and death is that, like both actually are needed in Gaiman's cosmology, like the one like death from the Sandman is actually there at the moment of death, then it's Azrael's job to take the soul to wear it where its final spot is, final destination. Yeah, which I think is really interesting that those two jobs are different. But both of those characters Azrael in this series and Death in the original in the Sandman series are actually really like open and friendly and compassionate women in this case, and so I'm appreciating that from the mind of Neil Gaiman.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I can recall. I have not read all of Sandman, I've only read the first few series.
Speaker 2:I read them but it was 20 years ago, I think volume Because they were originally out like the actual comics. But then they were.
Speaker 3:I read them in volumes, yeah yeah, I read the first volume and I can recall there's a point where Sandman follows Death on her, and not a whole lot has really stuck with me, but that like the man who says Shma and the child.
Speaker 3:She says that's all I got. And she's like sorry, it's how it goes sometimes. It's how it goes sometimes, yeah, and that's like just really stuck with me, also because she is so patient, she's very gentle with the baby. It's a terrible break, I'm sorry. And then the man who says look, it never occurred to me that I would actually say the Shma, but I'm glad I had a chance to do it. So yeah, it was. And for those who don't know, the Shma is the prayer that every Jew is supposed to say upon waking, upon going to bed. And is it just before death or is it on the day of your death?
Speaker 2:Ideally it would be the final words on your lips, and so I have seen, like it's kind of adorable, like Orthodox children at like a water park, like say it at the top of the slide in case they die on the slide because it's meant to be the final. I'm sorry that's not funny, but I just think it's adorable. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So it is the central prayer of the way that the faith has turned into a religion. Yeah, essentially so it's. The one hero is real, the Lord, your God. The Lord is one. Yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, that's what I was going to bring us to.
Speaker 2:That's what I was going to bring us to. Yeah, so Ray Ray, yeah, I love her. Cat sweater Adorable, adorable nickname. Cat sweater I am adorable as well. The whole costuming for her was just wonderful. There's something really compelling to me about the way when she explains to Lucifer in the last scene, like how she only ever gets to interact with them when they're dead humans, I mean and they're so morose and like Ella was such a different, you know, just a Ray Ray, uh-huh. Yeah, there was something really compelling about that, especially within the context of this show where we've seen these celestials repeatedly kind of start at arm's length and kind of like condescend to humans and then grow to really appreciate and love us and so to have the angel of death sort of name that you know, that like how much more alive we are when we're alive, which is I don't know. It was satisfying to me for that. Yeah.
Speaker 3:I also appreciated that the episode starts with Ella arriving at the crime scene. Yes, and so we get to see a warning routine, basically, and know that her chippiness is and her connection with all the people.
Speaker 2:I have to say, though, overthinking it Like, how does she know all that stuff? Like what did we? Like? I was led to believe and maybe I misperceived it that we were watching her arrive at the crime scene for the first time, but then she already knows all this stuff about what's happening. Like, did she come back to it? Did we miss something that was missing in the montage?
Speaker 3:I think that was the montage, and then I think it was when you were supposed to have like shooting pictures and then like time passed before.
Speaker 2:I'm too, I'm too, I'm too literal, like I wish they had actually said two hours later, and then I could have, like, followed. I don't know, I was like. That was like an overthinking moment for me. It was a little bit problematic, yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, I get that, I get that. What kind of work Like with the flash and everything. I don't think so.
Speaker 2:That's one of my least favorite. Actually Luciferisms is the dick pic joke. I don't know. I mean there was that other. There was one episode where he talked about the roosters, the prize roosters website Maybe sending it there, but I don't know that I don't. I appreciate and enjoy the sexual Lucifer, but the grass Lucifer, the dick pics, I don't like that. Like I think part of his, for me, part of his appeal is the elegance, and obviously elegance can be sexualized. But there's nothing elegant about dick pics. I just don't. I it's my least favorite joke about him.
Speaker 3:Yeah, fair enough. It's also like at this point that's a leaning into like the adolescent humor because he is kind of an overgrung teenager. But we're three years in, he's kind of past that at least at work.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and especially because. Then what is that? That? The consequences of dick pics on the forensics camera. Ella is the one who's going to pay the price for that, not him. So yeah, that did not land well. Yeah, and the suit he's wearing that tan brown suit with the blue Awful, awful, not a fan. It's sort of like baby diarrhea brown, it's not good. Yeah, it's sanitarium when I wear brown it's hard to find something isn't flattering on Tom Ellis, but they managed with that color.
Speaker 3:We know. Yeah, yeah, but let's talk a little bit about the case. Yeah, sure, oh, I haven't overthink that. Okay, the way they found the case is Beckett the scamming 14 year old girl was not actually taking her tears because she's allergic to freesia. And so Chloe goes to interview the mother, who wears a freesia perfume, but she hadn't been there.
Speaker 2:Right, well, presumably it was all over her family. Yeah, the kid had been there. Yeah, yeah, it's a little tenuous, yeah, so, especially because the report from Dan was that the place reeked of it, which would imply that the mother herself had been there, when in fact it was the dad. Yeah, yeah, that's fair. I think that's fair.
Speaker 3:It could have been. Just, you know like this is already shown to be kind of an unpleasant 14-year-old kid, and so when she reeked of it, true, she could have just said that because it was enough to trigger her knowledge. Yeah, that's the story of Dan losing back at the end of the story and then losing her, losing back at it was weird, like it felt like it's flags sponsor the show, because I really don't understand.
Speaker 3:It was just. It was very, very odd. Not that it was the kid getting away from Dan and playing him, like that. I'm totally down with having that story line. I think it's an interesting story, particularly where it gets to where he finally gets through to her and she's like this is serious and you know it's okay if you make a mistake. That's a whole six-flag thing. And then when they needed Mays to track her down but they didn't they really needed her for a ride, like like they just didn't have the brain in drag her down. They just went back to watch, like they got in the box and then they wouldn't have had Mays making fun of them, although Mays' reaction was mmm, yeah, that was good.
Speaker 2:I think for the mirroring that they do, they needed Lucifer to make a mistake that even Lucifer would admit was a mistake, and so losing the kid and having her steal his car, I think after having roasted Dan for the same mistake. I mean, that was the storytelling function that it serves, so that at the end, when he confronts Azrael and she says nobody's perfect, okay, fair enough. Yeah, that was like the wicked that that story knocked over.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I'm just realizing how thick this episode is because we have to hurry yeah.
Speaker 2:And LS. So like I don't know, I'm a normie. I mean that's a normal person.
Speaker 3:A normal person. So I recently took my youngest, my eight year old, to a Renaissance fair here in Wisconsin, and in the time since you and I went to Renaissance fairs, we were teenagers in the 90s and now you're in a fine Luciferese at the Renaissance fair, which makes sense.
Speaker 3:I just it was new to me and we were in the Kings and Queens, like Meadow, whatever they call it, and there was a knight fully dressed in a furry costume and armor, and it wasn't armor, it was like a. It was like a king that had had a. Okay.
Speaker 2:But but a furry.
Speaker 3:Not a shield on it, but okay, but a furry. Okay, like fully Uh-huh. And my son was like, oh, that's gone, let's get on. And then like the, the furry I don't remember what he did, but like he did a bow or something like that. And then he's the, the mouth opened and closed, and he's like, oh, that's pretty cool, we're pretty fancy. And my son was just like, oh, how'd you do that? And then the mouth opened and closed again and he's like I'm so excited. I was like all right, in 20 years, if he is going to furry conventions.
Speaker 3:I'll know what the origin story is. Which I won't hide except that I know that they've got a Nazi problem on my furry community. So that's, if there's not a Nazi problem in most every community, yeah, yeah, like some of my little ponies have a.
Speaker 2:I know the bronies, I know.
Speaker 3:So anyway, that was a long time ago, just that, you know, I, I, I find the furry phenomenon unique, interesting in a way that I like, because I just can't wrap my head around it. But I also, I love me some some like business. So, like like I would, I can't see myself ever.
Speaker 2:It's too much effort for you, em. There's like there's no way, like I mean, you and I can barely be bothered to like you know, I don't know brush our hair for this show. Like we're not going to, like, maintain a costume like that. I mean, I would get it. Yeah Well, I can't brush my because it would take the curls out, but you know what I mean.
Speaker 3:I noticed in the scene where, where I was wearing the the Wesley furry costume at some point when there's having the fight, there's a little girl there wearing a unicorn onesie of the kind that I desperately want when I'm like that is the kind of thing I can get, so that's the level of effort that you're willing to put into this.
Speaker 2:See, that's just it. You know you secretly, you want to be a furry, but the barriers are just too high. That's actually how I feel about Goth. I want to be Goth, but I do not have the effort or attention to do the work. That's a lot of work.
Speaker 3:Well, and I'm also thinking like the thing over your head. It just that seems like it would be so fun. Yeah, Agreed, Agreed.
Speaker 2:Not a fan, All right. So I I know it was supposed to make me laugh, but and and I guess it did make me chuckle but the fact that Lucifer knew the angel of death was in town because Ella said smell you later. I mean especially because that implies that, like 10,000 years ago or whatever, the angel of death was already saying it. Because they haven't spoken, They've been estranged since the rebellion. Yeah, that's, that's what we're allowed to believe. But all those eons ago, Azrael was already saying or what language Smell you later?
Speaker 2:Like what? Is it Benaromantic? I don't know. No, like some proto-Semitic Erdu? No, not Erdu. Erdu's from the subcontinent? Yeah, no, it would. No, no.
Speaker 3:I'm, what am I thinking of? The, the, the Indo like that language.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, some Indo-Semitic. Yes, agreed, yes, yes.
Speaker 3:That's where I got Erdu with moving into, so yeah.
Speaker 2:And her nickname was already Ray Ray back then. Ray Ray Because she said what you're too cool to call me Ray Ray now, yeah.
Speaker 3:I, I now am like you, know what, I feel like you and I need to figure out how to say smell you later and see blue.
Speaker 2:I, I actually can figure that out, I can figure that out.
Speaker 3:I know when it wouldn't be that difficult. People is dead and then redirected.
Speaker 2:Exactly, exactly, and so I, I could just speak. One of those speak to one of those.
Speaker 3:Any of our 15 subscribers happen to be Israel. Yeah, yeah, the the actual case. Instead of it being a reflection of Lucifer, it's a reflection of Ella, this time, because she has to come to terms with the fact that she's different and that's okay, in the same way that the little boy, the, the violin player, is different, and that's what makes an amazing. Yeah, nice, so, which was, which was pretty cool and storytelling wise and like it's a solid episode.
Speaker 3:Even with this, I hate me like you introduce a problem at the very beginning of the episode that, out of nowhere, that is resolved by the end of the episode is a very great event. So like, oh, my little brother is moving back to Detroit, so I'm going to have to move back to Detroit, and you know they needed an inciting incident, they needed like a reason for Rare to come back, and you know it's a well written episode. That is just something I'm very sensitive to in stories where it's just like you just introduced this problem to immediately solve it. So in the same way, I really hate it in books where they try to raise tension when killing off a minor character you've never met before by giving that minor character immediate back story before they die. It's just like you know. You haven't earned that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's kind of like when you watch those those elimination competition creative shows. My spouse and I have realized that if you learn a whole lot of backstory about one of the characters, they're going home that episode. That's how it works.
Speaker 3:So it's just and it's a storytelling shortcut that sometimes you need and I but I like I'm very sensitive to where, like I feel like you haven't earned this and I wish there had been something like we've been introduced to a younger brother before we know that she came out for him in some ways.
Speaker 3:I wish there had been something at some point earlier about the possibility of him moving home. Yeah, and you also want to say that, in the sense of this episode coming right after a devil of my word and quintessential Deca-shark's opposite order, always reaction to Ella saying I see ghosts was amazing and perfect and kind of goes to show that, like what we were talking about before, where Ella is not so much about shipping Hecker or Deckerstar, she just wants her really good friend, who she looks up to be happy and so that really kind of ends. It makes me because I know that Amy Garcia is about same age as the rest of the cast, but it'll be allowed to be like I think Ella is younger, yeah, and so because I know Amy Garcia is about same age, it's I kind of forget sometimes that she's supposed to be younger, but I think it's much clearer now Like, oh no, there's definitely.
Speaker 2:Like there's the hero worship aspect of it which Ella is prone to, oh yeah.
Speaker 3:And also makes sense if she's. I mean, I don't know, she's got a little brother, but she's got bigger siblings, Right.
Speaker 2:So Diamond Cleaner is the older brother, yeah.
Speaker 3:But, like I know, as the youngest in our family, I was prone to hero worship and I think that that's common among younger siblings.
Speaker 2:So yeah, all right, let's talk about Once Upon a Time, because we don't have forever. So, okay, I just want to say, as a huge Game and Fan, not as big as they come. For sure there are many who are more dedicated. I see you, and I think that Neil Gaiman is among the best storytellers of our generation. He's such a great storyteller and that Gaiman put his stamp of approval on this TV show by voicing God is just so satisfying on so many levels, so letter, Just so many levels, that he agreed to voice, to do the voiceover as God. A little confusing now that I know Dennis Haysbert is God, but I didn't know that when I was watching it here.
Speaker 3:So just having said that, I just had this thought Another one of the greatest storytellers of our generation is Jordan Peele, and I just realized I now need Neil Gaiman and Jordan Peele.
Speaker 2:Oh wow, that would be amazing. That would be amazing. That would be incredible.
Speaker 3:Anyway, universe, yeah, yeah, yeah. And then also the meta message at the end where it's like a child, just a parent, wants what's best for their child, best for their child. And so that's God talking about Lucifer, that's talking about John Decker and Chloe Decker, but that's also Neil Gaiman talking about his intellectual child, and Gaiman has to say there are so many people who are like, oh, this is not.
Speaker 2:Oh right, people want to gatekeep on Gaiman's work and Gaiman he shuts that down. No one gets to gatekeep Sandman he says no, which is the original source material for this Lucifer? I am just so. I mean, talk about hero worship, the guy just gets it and he gets what art is and what it's for. And yeah, I agree, I don't know that I made that connection before, you just said it, but it's really, really deeply resonating for me. Yeah, yeah, there were things that I liked very much about this episode and there were other things that just I don't know, I don't know, it just wasn't Like Linda's cleavage. Oh, I liked her cleavage. I liked her cleavage. I did not like her glasses. Yeah, I didn't like her glasses. They were very old fashioned, to like 1970s looking. I also like I don't know, I didn't really like where Linda was. I mean, I wasn't supposed to like where Linda was in this alternate universe. What was?
Speaker 3:interesting to me about Linda in this alternate universe is your game and, as God says, you know you might choose immoral, make immoral choices that still have the same conscience. And it made me realize, because she does things that are kind of unethical in our universe, but never immoral, yeah, and that that actually, like that was an interesting thing for me to realize. Like you know, she does for the most part was best for her patients, with the possible exception of sleeping with Lucifer, but at the time it didn't really matter for him, right? And then, once it did, she stopped Right, whereas what she might have been doing in that that universe may have been ethically okay I don't know, I mean ethically do be a personnel it was definitely immoral, yeah, it was definitely not right for her patients. Yeah, yeah, I find her her story arc is upsetting Dan and Charlotte's interesting in that they in that universe they get a happy ending, except that they don't, because they'll both end up in hell. And you know, trixie obviously doesn't exist, right. But there's a little part of me that's glad that in some universe they get to have a happy ending, even if he's awful, if she's kind of awful, yeah, but there's something within him and something within her that finds each other, in the same way that there's something within Lucifer, something within Chloe that finds each other, no matter what universe they're in.
Speaker 3:I have to say, casting wise, the actor playing her dad. The first time I saw this I was like man, that makeup is amazing, because I was certainly. It was the same dude, exactly the same actor who's actually Leslie and Brant's husband. Oh yeah, he plays John Decker as a young man. But well, that's a different actor, like it's an older man, and every time I see it I go like how is this guy? I just like him and maybe if I watched them back to back like you wouldn't think so. I wouldn't think so, but every time, like you look exactly like John Decker. Yeah, I appreciate that he is able at the end to say like this is not about you.
Speaker 2:It's about me. He's like the John Decker that we get here is very mature and enlightened, or he gets to be at the very end. They give him a very, very, very nice yes in lightens, although the way he treats her prior to that is pretty. I know that's what I say. He gets to be, he gets there.
Speaker 3:And that, like is rationale. Actually, as a parent, makes sense to me.
Speaker 2:No but yes, and she's supposed to be like 35. I mean, I'm sorry, but you don't get to say go home to your 35 year old daughter. I mean, our dad's not saying anything to us, so maybe I would, I guess I would take it, I guess I would take it.
Speaker 3:Yeah, particularly since she's not clear on acting being the right thing for her.
Speaker 2:And the like your mom told me to remind you, to remind them to film from your best side, like ew.
Speaker 3:Well, and that's part of season one, when we first meet Penelope.
Speaker 3:Yeah, the overbearing stage mother, yeah, the overbearing stage mother thing, and it's just like, yeah, I would hate that so much. Clearly she does. I mean, one of the things I thought that I really liked in this alternate universe is when they're going after also, they didn't go very far, but they're going after a guy stealing a Porsche and Liz Fergo drives. She's like no, I have literally been trained for this. This is kind of cool because she has been Like I'm sure she's had some sort of driver training and stuff like that. Although how much of that did they actually have it for too?
Speaker 2:Yeah, the thing that bothered me is that she came to the NASCAR set from this movie franchise that I'm imagining is like a cross between Fast and the Furious and something else, and she's using the character's name and nobody but Lucifer recognizes her. I don't buy it.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, I was like why wouldn't she use a different name? But then you're like, oh, it probably actually has a funny genero written on it, so she's felt like she has to use that name. But you could just flash it and then I don't.
Speaker 2:I mean it said Property of Warner Brothers On the back exactly. I don't that like yeah, that gave me pause in my overthinking that. Like I mean, if Dwayne the Rack Johnson or Vin Diesel showed up at a you know at a race track and tried to use his name from the movies, like people would be like oh, it's Vin Diesel, somebody besides Lucifer.
Speaker 3:The thing is, though I think she's supposed to be like, still a relatively minor character in the franchise. I don't think so.
Speaker 2:I don't think so Not after five, like it's a whole five movie.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and she uses the. I don't know if you notice she has the. They have a lot of Easter eggs in there, so like she uses the weaponizer tech trays on my watch, yep. And then at NASCAR they're sponsored by Top Meet, which is that Right? That's the meeting.
Speaker 2:The singles, the dating app for rich people, exclusive people, top hats, yeah, yeah, I just, I think, especially because it's a weaponizer, which in our universe is a successful like martial arts franchise, like I think she's meant to be a movie star. Yeah, yeah, I mean, she did go to Lux without crazy paparazzi. So maybe I don't know, but I that feels like a piece that the writers really just just just do it, just go with it, just work with us here. She's a movie star who nobody recognizes. I don't know, that happens, yeah. Maybe all the NASCAR people have face blindness or something. I don't know.
Speaker 3:Well, maybe it's just that. Well, I'm taking NASCAR.
Speaker 2:They would watch the weaponizer.
Speaker 3:They would watch the weaponizer. I was like maybe there's no code in the sauce or no other stuff.
Speaker 2:Especially if it's like Fast and Furious, which is the implication I got you know with the fancy car and stuff that she was supposed to drive the next day.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, I do want to like in this universe. How does Ella get?
Speaker 2:to watch on this universe? Well, that's a great question. I mean, her younger brother was like stealing cars and stuff, so maybe she still went with him. It's just, instead of to take care of him, she went to help him. I don't know.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:Well, first of all, I love her look, oh my God, with the tattoo sleeve and the like 1940s. Yeah, adorable, adorable. And she had the big hoop earrings too. Well, that was very like leaning into the Latina. I mean that is like a very stereotypical Latina look with the big hoops.
Speaker 3:But it looks amazing with that kind of 1940s. Oh my God, yeah, love that look. And then it made sense that that would be who she was in an alternate universe, like she'd be just as nerdy, just a smart and capable, smart and, yeah, just in a different direction. And you know, I thought that she, like our elegant, protect you. It was amazing, I mean, if she wanted. So, yeah, I really appreciated that there's just a very little bit of a men's deal in this episode. Oh yeah.
Speaker 2:Because he's like he's presumably just flying around waiting for this.
Speaker 3:It does give us a little bit of a glimpse into who a men's deal is.
Speaker 2:Without the influence of Lucifer and humans.
Speaker 3:Yes, and that he's the one who can be influenced by as well, because he takes it and tries to take his advice and and check it out. Yeah and yeah, oh no.
Speaker 2:There's been some endearing. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I think it's time for some fluff. Okay, because we've been talking for like 40 minutes now.
Speaker 3:Yeah, okay, what fluff do you have? I'm not sure I have.
Speaker 2:Oh, shoot, okay. So here's, here's like little little purry and fluff. I've seen when John Decker catches up to Chloe and she's like what is he doing? He's been in the trailer for a long time and then finally we realize what he's doing, like he actually says yes, say my name, which, which I'm blushing, which feels like I don't know. It sort of doesn't feel like keeping with Lucifer's like sexual persona and I and at the same time I found it totally too late- she's a female.
Speaker 3:She reflects the other person's desires, and so, if her desire, I mean she was yelling his name.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I guess, so, I guess, so, I don't know. And then, and then, like the like lipstick and like John and John's, I pumped her For me yeah, oh, my God, yeah, that was, that was.
Speaker 3:I also appreciated the way that John Decker referred to him as a messy. Oh, my club owner, please don't tell me you're hanging out with that guy Like, oh, and it's worse. I'm just like, yeah, that's going to be like as embarrassing as it'd be to be a 35 year old woman have your dad say go home.
Speaker 2:I mean, at least it wasn't Chloe and Chloe and have yeah, I guess, oh, my goodness. And then then he was like she's her ankle and I guess the other little piece of fluff is like to make sure we knew it was an alternate universe. The Corvette was red, right Like when Spock had the mustache. It was evil but like they showed us in that throwback prequel episode when he stole the Corvette it was black and like John, not getting shot wouldn't have changed the color of the car, maybe had a pain.
Speaker 3:Yeah, john, not getting shot with no effect of Ella, true, I mean, it's one of those butterfly effect things. So instead of it being the black car, like it, was what he found it was, it was a red, true, yeah, okay, so cuz you, yeah, okay.
Speaker 2:Also very convenient that he happens to be wearing the waistcoat. It just wasn't the vest, it just wasn't buttoned up. So he like buttoned it to cover the but the build the bullet holes like that was very convenient. Also as I mentioned, with the bullets the Charlotte took excellence. I Mean, does his celestial body just like absorb the lead and, like I don't know, turning it into energy or something, or like are there holes in the back of his blazer?
Speaker 3:Well, I'm imagining like it gets through the shirt and then stops with his skin, and it was sort of false.
Speaker 2:Okay, so you have to like, clean him out of his belt. I.
Speaker 3:Don't remind me of one thing about John Decker being overprotective After you got a bullet that he survived. It's also much more understandable why he would push Chloe away from the idea. So it's becoming a cop, yeah, after that. Yeah, agreed. And I do like the way that the voiceover by Neil Gaiman is said. It's Hard to say whether he's saying like, the move the bullet, and it's this is the alternate universe for you move the bullet and that's like I don't know there's, there's a little bit of oh, you mean, like he made John die, oh yeah which and I was trying to think that because I just read something from one saying about like, oh, that's not okay.
Speaker 2:I'm like that is not how I heard it. I heard this is an alternate universe where he didn't die, or John's.
Speaker 3:But in order for this ultimate universe to happen, god did have to interfere and move the bullet which presumably God could have done in our universe.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, which is kind of. I mean, that is the ultimate Cosmological dilemma. If God is good, you know, if God is great, then God can't be good. And if God is good, then God can't be great, because why would God let all this happen? Yeah, yeah, I have to go.
Speaker 3:Now I am being summoned, all right, yeah, I'm going to be imagining like Lucifer, just like shaking bullets out of his waistband. I can't like because he walked Nice.
Speaker 2:I like it, I like it. All right, see you next week.
Speaker 1:Our theme song is feral angel waltz by Kevin McLeod from incompetentcom, licensed under creative commons by attribution 4.0 license. Visit the show notes for the url. I am an artificially generated voice powered by narrakeepcom. Lucifer is a Warner Brothers production that first aired on Fox and then Netflix. Tracy and Emily are not affiliated with Fox, netflix nor WB. If you liked this episode, subscribe to keep overthinking with them and visit the show notes for other ways to connect.